Beware of Trolls!

[Carolina]

Dearest Sjogren's Angels,

I've been here for about a year and a half, but I've been in on line groups for about 14 years.

This is a fantastic group, and has been my strength and my joy as my health is slowly declining.  I value this group above all things on line.

In my time I've experienced just about every possible kind of scenario you can imagine.

in one virtual reality group there was a 'woman' who spent months involving all of us in her "health problem", in great and agonizing detail.  "She" turned out to be what is called a 'troll'.  Someone who enjoyed creating a crisis and then involving everyone in the fantasy.   And it all turned out to be just that, a fantasy.

There are groups of people who are trolls.  This is their joy in life, putting people on with extended 'fake situations'.  One such 'troll' occurred as a memorial to the girl who committed suicide because a neighborhood woman pretended to be an on line 'boyfriend' and then dumped her.  In the memorial, the 'troll' lured people into posting their feelings and share sympathy with each other, but the entire thing was false.

Here is Wikipedia on that topic:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet) 

I have also had lots of experience, both on line and face to face with people who play the 'ya, but' game.

The game involves one person with a problem, and any number of people with suggestions.  The suggestions are always rebutted with:  "YA, but I can't do that because".    It goes on as long as anyone is willing to keep trying to find solutions to 'the problem'.   

These people aren't trolls, but they also aren't ready to really deal with whatever 'the problem' is, which is a real problem.

I played this game with a friend for years, before I realized that it was taking a lot of time and effort on my part, and just going in circles.  So I just changed the subject when she started.

Eventually she WAS ready to address her concern, and made some of the changes I had recommended. 

This process was clearly part of her preparation process, no doubt.   But I became tired of getting sucked in over and over again.  When she was ready she moved on.

And of course there ARE hypochondriacs and there ARE "drama queens and kings" seeking attention in every venue.  And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

We're all more than a little 'odd', well ME, for sure.   

All THAT SAID:  I usually take people everywhere in life at face value.  It's too much work worrying that people are putting me on and trying to play a game.   I find that being myself and treating others the same way is far more useful and rewarding.

Just some thoughts on my years of learning and enjoying life.

Hugs

Elaine

[A66eyroad]

I've never heard the term "trolls" but I have privately thought of some people as vampires --- they suck the lifeblood out of you. They somehow worm their way into your life and your heart and make you feel as though you're somehow responsible for them. I've had enough of them in my life to know them for what they are pretty quickly. These days, I don't have the energy to deal with them and so I make it a point to not let them in.

In the medical field, isn't that called Munchausen Syndrome? A need to draw attention to themselves for pity and sympathy?

[irish]

I am of the impression that Munchaussen syndrome is directed at the relationship between a emotionally sick mom with their child. The mom who works at making sure her kid is sick and continues to be sick so she can get attention. Could be it applys to other situations though. Hope I find out for sure.

As to the "trolls" I can attest to this occurring on this site. There are also the people who have emotional issues who are not able to rise above complaining and keeping the entire forum worrying and angonizing over their bad luck with the medical profession.

These people also tend to never get any medical help from all their doctoring. Sometimes these people are the troll type who enjoy leading the forum on and drawing them into their long drawn out suffering.

The others are people who have so much emotional baggage and don't relate well to others. They will never get all the sympathy they need and they don't know how to cope with what life has handed them.

It is very sad but it is also very unfair to others. These people drag out their suffering and literally suck the life blood out of the rest of us(and all who interact with them) until we don't have the energy to deal with it anymore. I can only imagine how hard this must be on their doctors and their families. There is not one darn thing we can ever do or say that will help these people because they choose not to be helped.

They many times enjoy their suffering. If they aren't enjoying the suffering it is then because they just don't want or can't co-operate with health care workers who are trying to give them the help they need---maybe stubborness, poor insight, whatever.

Sometimes these people need to be confronted and given the old "tough love" action that I speak of often. It is hard to deal with these people. Sort of reminds me of raising teenagers. They like to argue and carry on lots of conversations that go nowhere but don't listen nor pick up on the good advice given by others. Sort of pull your hair out - fly by the seat of your pants interaction without any gratification---ever. Irish

[Carolina]

Hi Irish,

What you are describing is Munchhausen by Proxy.

see the second paragraph in this Wiki site.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M?nchausen_syndrome

Trolls are technically people who deliberately lie to create a big stir on a web site.

The others are mostly just sad people who don't quite 'get it' most of the time.

It takes all kinds.

I think I used to play 'ya, but' when I was trying to psych myself up for a big life change.  I wound up going to grad school for an MBA, but you would have thought I was responsible for the fate of the world.  Well at least one friend listened to me struggle for a year or two!

She was endlessly patient with 'ya but' and really didn't make suggestions, just listened to me groan and moan about getting old and not knowing what to do when I 'grew up'.

Course I realized I didn't plan to grow up, so that wasn't the problem!

Hugs

Elaine

Still not grown up.  Just getting older.

[aussie mum]

I guess I am too trusting (others would say gullible) to notice these "Trolls".

[mshistory]

I guess I am too trusting (others would say gullible) to notice these "Trolls".

Me too.

[anita]

I always thought trolls were like the wiki definition...inflammatory, off topic posts that provoke readers and annoy everyone.

The ones on medical forums (a couple here included) that make up stories to get you emotionally involved are more like munchhausen...attention seekers with no true medical problems.  They just want sympathy and attention.  They usually are not inflammatory so I would not call them trolls.  They are however, worse than trolls in many ways.

Good topic though.

[irish]

We haven't had a lot of these people on here, but there have been more than people realize. When I was a moderator I was exposed to this in a more specific way.

However, there are many little "signs" that one learns to watch for to identify these people. We have had some very blatant ones who came in "loaded for bear" and thought they could get by with murder. Administrators of this site got rid of them quite soon.

Some of these types are often here but because they haven't broken any laws on the forum they can't be kicked off. However, they wreck havoc on the site and get people so upset that arguements and totally disruptive behavior develop and can really ruins the site. Just keep watch and you will notice this from time to time. Sometimes it is so subtle that many people will miss it.

If administration addresses it and the people leave it settles things down quite a bit. Many people don't recognize what is happening because they are not looking for it or they are not so in tune with behaviors that cause this disension.  The adminsitrators of this site and others have to watch closely to keep things stable.

There are many sites out there that have poor administrators and that is where a lot of the argueing, bad language and big time trouble can start. Those sites are no fun at all. Thanks to our administrators our site has remained a good place to hang out. Irish

[hollowoakfarm]

I've had people get mad at me for their assumption that I am playing "yeah, but."  What is actually happening in many cases is that the person giving "advice" has no clue at all about what the person is truely dealing with.  Those same people who tell us "you just need more exercise," or "you need to try this herb," or whatever, think that when we refuse we are playing that game.  They walk away thinking to themselves that if we would just try we could get better, but since we refuse to listen to their good advice then it's all our fault, of course.  I no longer assume that because someone doesn't take my advice that they are choosing not to help themselves.  I assume that I don't know enough to offer advice, and that for many, there may well be nothing I can offer.  Maybe for most.  And I know how much all that well-meaning advice irritates me, so I do try not to foist it on others.

[Shade]

Well, good to hear the administrators are staying on top of this.  In the last couple of months, there's been at least two posters I had serious doubts about.  I didn't respond to their posts and maybe that's the best way to handle them.

I'm going to try to find their posts and see if they are still members...just curious.

[Carolina]

I agree Shade.

After a bit (usually quite a bit, cause I give everyone the benefit of the doubt) I usually just pull back.

Oh, hollowoakfarm, I KNOW what you mean.  We do get the oddest most useless advice, don't we?

I guess I don't count those cases as examples of the 'ya, but' game!

I also don't ask for advice about my health, tho' I suppose sometimes my moans and groans might seem like a plea for help!

I mean I ask for help HERE, but in my 'real life' I don't expect anyone to understand.

And generally they don't even try.   

This is the place I come to for comfort and straight talk.

Hugs

Elaine

[Shade]

I couldn't agree more Elaine.  In my 'real life' I try not to mention my illness.  I think, I would be very depressing to be around if people knew how I felt a great deal of the time.  Sad; but, probably true.

Thank goodness we have each other.

Shade

[Pisces24]

I think I have a "troll" where I work at. I just learned to limit my exposure to her. You just have to do that with certain personality types.

You know the personality type: it is all about me, glass is 1/2 empty, so-n-so made me sick or will make me sick, you really should xxxx (insert a critique with a personal reference), and complain complain complain. 
Gosh even with the Sjogrens, I am soooooo glad I am not her! 

[Autoimmunity]

I do come here and ask for advice; I like to know how people handled certain things or what they think of whatever the issue I am going through is.  Just because somebody gives me advice do I feel obligated to take it?  Not on your life.  Or a lot of times it's not advice that I necessarily agree with, but I am grateful that somebody bothered to read my post and offer it. 
I totally agree there are sometimes people on here that you can tell are trying to stir things up or are just needy needy needy and I just move on and don't even bother responding.  If they don't get the attention they want they will move on.
I am a member of a certain breed of dog forum and have been for more that 10 years.  Several years back we had a girl join crying and moaning and begging for help for her ill dog.  Never took any of the advice or assistance offered.  Long story short it was a total scam for money.  She drew so many people in with this story of her ill dog, got them to donate towards it's care and took all their money.  I would have never believed somebody could do that.  That was quite an education. 
I listen to my gut feeling I get about people and I can usually tell right away and I just don't even bother with them.

[Autoimmunity]

I think I have a "troll" where I work at. I just learned to limit my exposure to her. You just have to do that with certain personality types.

You know the personality type: it is all about me, glass is 1/2 empty, so-n-so made me sick or will make me sick, you really should xxxx (insert a critique with a personal reference), and complain complain complain. 
Gosh even with the Sjogrens, I am soooooo glad I am not her!

Oh my gosh, I do too!  I was getting very friendly with her and noticed she would say one thing and then in the next sentence say something entirely different.  At first I thought I was nuts!!  She is some type of pathological liar and has been caught steeling peoples food from the fridge and even stealing from the cafeteria.  I can't even leave my purse, cell phone, meds on my desk to run to the restroom.  Makes me so angry!  No longer friendly with her.  I won't tolerate that type of behavior.