Sorry to be so graphic, but there is no other way to describe what I'm presently going through. I'm not even sure whether this would be Sjogren related or not. I sometimes have that problem with various symptoms. In any event, I have had problems with defecating. It's not what I would call 'constipation,' but rather, a problem of my stool literally getting stuck in my rectum. Apart of the stool comes out okay, but then a big chunk is stuck in my rectum. Needless to say, it's annoying, messy and out and out uncomfortable. I also have IBS, so maybe it's related to that. I'm just curious if others have had the same problem?? ::)
Once again, I do apologize for my descriptive nature...
Barrie***
Barrie, I don't think there's anything too graphic to discuss, if it's causing you problems.
I have a similar problem. My colo-rectal surgeon thinks it is Sjogren's related, but my rheumie isn't sure.
I'm female and have obstructed defecation due to failure to relax the pubo-rectalis muscle. It has caused me to have several pelvic prolapse repairs and a rectopexy for intussusception. However, I no longer have any prolapses, and am still struggling. When I see my colo-rectal surgeon early next month, I'm expecting him to suggest I start using rectal irrigation. If you google Peristeen, you will see what that entails.
Speak to your doctors. There may be a simple explanation, but even if there isn't, there is bound to be something to help you.
Hugs
Kathyx
Thanks for that info, Kathy!! I'm only sorry to hear all that you're going through!!! I'm more inclined to believe what your colo-rectal surgeon says about it might be Sjogren related. I've had this problem on numerous occasions. It's more of an intermittent problem, that comes and goes!!
Barrie***
Could it be a rectal cell? My mom has one. Bandwidth unstable today -ugh!
Kendo
Quote from: Kendo on February 22, 2014, 01:48:34 PM
Could it be a rectal cell? My mom has one. Bandwidth unstable today -ugh!
Kendo
I'm not really sure what the problem is, Kendo. Sometimes when I talk to my rheumy about these things he just tunes me out and quite frankly, I'm tired of it. I wish I could change doctors, but we only have a handful of rheumy's in the area!!
Barrie, not too graphic at all.
I did have my adorable granddaughter once ask me if I ever had a poop come out and 'hang like a cocoon" from my bottom. I almost died suppressing my laughter. Think of the 'hanging like a cocoon', next time.
I think most of us have problems defecating, as you so delicately put it. While there 'may be a million reasons and problems' and I am NOT a medical professional, the first two that come to mind are:
Dryness
Autonomic Neuropathy.
With dryness we just absorb all of the moisture so stuff gets stuck and doesn't move well.
With Autonomic neuropathy the gastric peristalsis that should be moving things along isn't working properly.
I have a place in my esophagus, for example, that doesn't work. So I can be merrily eating and chewing and swallowing, only to find that the last bite goes nowhere because everything has been going down and stopping! It is called 'an incompetent esophagus". Sometimes I have to 'force the stuff out' It isn't vomiting because is isn't coming from my stomach. It is weird. Sometimes it hurts horribly. Sometimes I can drink something if I discover it before there's no room left.
I also have what is called 'idiopathic intestinal blockage' this is when for no apparent reason your small intestine just stops working in one part. It can be fatal because if it doesn't unblock, or isn't unblocked surgically, the part that stopped will eventually die and gangrene will set it. For me is was unbelievably painful. Beyond description.
It involves three days and two nights in the hospital while they wait to see if it will unblock on its own or if they'll have to do surgery. It has always unblocked. But all that time with an NG tube, IV's, and agonizing pain.....not my cup of tea.
Now I know I have moderate autonomic neuropathy: I get dizzy when I stand, I have problems with my bladder and emptying it completely. And I have problems emptying my bowels. It is just no fun.
I'm sure people here will have great advice! I eat raisin bran for breakfast and that takes care of the constipation side of the equation. The incomplete emptying that you are experiencing has no solution that I've found.
I will stay tuned to see what is offered!
We're here Barrie and we can talk about anything. Trust me on that.
Hugs, Elaine
Quote from: Carolina on February 22, 2014, 02:40:30 PM
Barrie, not too graphic at all.
I did have my adorable granddaughter once ask me if I ever had a poop come out and 'hang like a cocoon" from my bottom. I almost died suppressing my laughter. Think of the 'hanging like a cocoon', next time.
I think most of us have problems defecating, as you so delicately put it. While there 'may be a million reasons and problems' and I am NOT a medical professional, the first two that come to mind are:
Dryness
Autonomic Neuropathy.
With dryness we just absorb all of the moisture so stuff gets stuck and doesn't move well.
With Autonomic neuropathy the gastric peristalsis that should be moving things along isn't working properly.
I have a place in my esophagus, for example, that doesn't work. So I can be merrily eating and chewing and swallowing, only to find that the last bite goes nowhere because everything has been going down and stopping! It is called 'an incompetent esophagus". Sometimes I have to 'force the stuff out' It isn't vomiting because is isn't coming from my stomach. It is weird. Sometimes it hurts horribly. Sometimes I can drink something if I discover it before there's no room left.
I also have what is called 'idiopathic intestinal blockage' this is when for no apparent reason your small intestine just stops working in one part. It can be fatal because if it doesn't unblock, or isn't unblocked surgically, the part that stopped will eventually die and gangrene will set it. For me is was unbelievably painful. Beyond description.
It involves three days and two nights in the hospital while they wait to see if it will unblock on its own or if they'll have to do surgery. It has always unblocked. But all that time with an NG tube, IV's, and agonizing pain.....not my cup of tea.
Now I know I have moderate autonomic neuropathy: I get dizzy when I stand, I have problems with my bladder and emptying it completely. And I have problems emptying my bowels. It is just no fun.
I'm sure people here will have great advice! I eat raisin bran for breakfast and that takes care of the constipation side of the equation. The incomplete emptying that you are experiencing has no solution that I've found.
I will stay tuned to see what is offered!
We're here Barrie and we can talk about anything. Trust me on that.
Hugs, Elaine
Thanks so much for your input, Elaine!! I'm only sorry that you have so much going on with your body, related to Sjogren's!! I couldn't stop laughing at that 'hanging like a cocoon' analogy!! It's hilarious!! :o !!! LOL!!! Unfortunately, I've had this problem on numerous occasions. Some days I have no problems defecating, other days it's a chore, pure and simple!!!
Anyhow, you take care of YOU!!! I appreciate your warm words of support ;D
Barrie***
Barrie
Just catching up on your thread here. First, regarding your rheumy? Almost sounds like he is more embarrassed than you to discuss the subject.
There are times we have to be graphic to get to the root of the problem.
Have you consulted with a gastroenterologist? That would be my first step. Actually I have a gastro doc for defication "issues". Recently diagnosed with pelvic floor dysfunction. Oh joy (NOT). Thankfully my gastro is a woman, else I would be reluctant to get graphic with a man gastro. Oddly, I prefer a man gyno doc to a woman gyno doc. Okay, I slid off topic a sec.
Additionally have a stupid hemmorhoid they found during colonoscopy INSIDE rectum somewhere which they didn't bother to do anything about. Yet they did remove a polyp - both being problematic aside from the constipation. And when that "roid" acts up stuff gets stuck and it isn't fun at all. It doesn't act up all the time either.
My suggestion would be consult with a gastroenterologist. Bowel problems aren't anything to fool around with, especially if things are not moving as they should - even if partially moving. Stool shouldn't be getting stuck. And if it is an issue as "simple" as inflammation for example, even that needs to be addressed.
@Elaine you had me cracking up about your granddaughter. Reminded me of an old Star Trek joke about circling a certain planet called Uranus looking for Klingons. I couldn't resist the opening to comment on that.
Amanda
Quote from: litliwlowa on February 22, 2014, 05:53:58 PM
Barrie
Just catching up on your thread here. First, regarding your rheumy? Almost sounds like he is more embarrassed than you to discuss the subject.
There are times we have to be graphic to get to the root of the problem.
Have you consulted with a gastroenterologist? That would be my first step. Actually I have a gastro doc for defication "issues". Recently diagnosed with pelvic floor dysfunction. Oh joy (NOT). Thankfully my gastro is a woman, else I would be reluctant to get graphic with a man gastro. Oddly, I prefer a man gyno doc to a woman gyno doc. Okay, I slid off topic a sec.
Additionally have a stupid hemmorhoid they found during colonoscopy INSIDE rectum somewhere which they didn't bother to do anything about. Yet they did remove a polyp - both being problematic aside from the constipation. And when that "roid" acts up stuff gets stuck and it isn't fun at all. It doesn't act up all the time either.
My suggestion would be consult with a gastroenterologist. Bowel problems aren't anything to fool around with, especially if things are not moving as they should - even if partially moving. Stool shouldn't be getting stuck. And if it is an issue as "simple" as inflammation for example, even that needs to be addressed.
@Elaine you had me cracking up about your granddaughter. Reminded me of an old Star Trek joke about circling a certain planet called Uranus looking for Klingons. I couldn't resist the opening to comment on that.
Amanda
Amanda...
My rheumy is usually pretty good about talking about issues. He just rarely does anything. He accepts Sjogren's as is and doesn't help me out when I'm really feeling poorly.
One primary not only suggested seeing a gastro doctor, but having a colonoscopy as well. It's been awhile since I had one done. I'm sure it's time. I just had the preparation for that procedure!! :-[
Thanks....
As a registered nurse I have worked with many people over the years who have had this issue.I think that this is a multifaceted issue. First of all, the sjogrens does cause the decrease of the mucus secretions in the intestinal tract which makes it difficult for the colon to move the stool on through the tract.
Secondly, our diets these days are not as full of fiber as it should be and we Americans really pay the price. The other thing is that sjogrens can cause some neuropathy in the intestinal tract that can slow the movement of the stool. The bottom line is dry stool with less fiber in a slow moving intestinal tract causes the stool to pack together to cause what is known as an "impaction" in the medical field. This is a stool that is literally too large and it overfills the rectum and can't be expelled through the anus as it is too large.
The "cure" is to soften the stool with fluids and foods that cause the stool to be softer and more rough. The roughness or fiber in the stool irritates the intestinal tract and causes it to move the stool along at a faster clip. This in turn keeps the stool from packing together and getting too large to pass through the anus.
One of the things we used to do in the past was to have people eat dates, prunes, raisins, etc that have been run through a food processor and mixed with bran. Actually it is quite good and is very good to eat at night in order to help stimulate the colon. If the colon is still sluggish some doctors would order milk of magnesia every other night or so to help stimulate the colon to become more active and move the stool along.
Any time you have a severe problem with constipation you need to check with a doctor if you can't solve it yourself in a week or two. Sometimes a bad impaction can be a dangerous thing and needs intervention in a medication setting in order to solve the problem. If you get a large enough impaction you can have stool that is stuck in the lower colon and rectum and actually have liquify/softer stool that will leak around the sides of the impaction and cause incontinence of stool. This happens a lot to the elderly, but has been known to happen to younger people also. Also, be aware that a problem with constipation that is ongoing can reason to suspect something of a more serious nature that needs to be checked out by a doctor.
Also, be aware that all of the psychotropic drugs (antidepressants, anti epileptics, tranquilizers, etc and many other drugs) can slow down the intestinal tract and cause severe constipation. If a person goes on an antidepressant it is my opinion that they should check with the doc about using a stool softener/laxative of some sort to head off this problem before it occurs.
Hope all of you with bowel issues can get them under control.Irish
I am glad this subject was brought up, because I have this problem with incomplete emptying all the time. It's weird too, because another thing that happens with me is when I feel the need to go pee, as I am doing that many times I start doing the other, but didn't know I needed too.
susanep
Along with what Irish posted have you been Rx'd Salagen, pilocarpine or such.
wiki search on on Saliva
" saliva that is produced in a healthy person per day; estimates range from 0.75 to 1.5 liters per day " http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saliva
Plus all the other benefits of saliva.
Sometimes periodic blockage can be from dehydration. We need more than the recommended 8 glasses of water a day + fiber from fruit, vegs ( OTC fiber supplement), high fiber cereal on a daily basis.
I have this issue..stomach just paralyzed..i have gastroparesis.
I think the neuro issues, muscle issues with sjogrens play a huge part.
I also learned that less fiber works better for me...too much can cause binding.
Ohhhhh, these stomachs. Seems so many of us have problems. Even as a child, I always had trouble.
I never got the "urge" to have a bowel movement...even back then, I had some gastroparesis, which I thought
was just constipation at the time.
Gursie
Quote from: irish on February 22, 2014, 09:43:51 PM
As a registered nurse I have worked with many people over the years who have had this issue.I think that this is a multifaceted issue. First of all, the sjogrens does cause the decrease of the mucus secretions in the intestinal tract which makes it difficult for the colon to move the stool on through the tract.
Is that you, Irish??? I remember you when I posted here a long time ago. How are you doing?? I appreciate your input. Especially since your a nurse, you know quite a bit.
Quote from: susanep on February 22, 2014, 10:15:51 PM
I am glad this subject was brought up, because I have this problem with incomplete emptying all the time. It's weird too, because another thing that happens with me is when I feel the need to go pee, as I am doing that many times I start doing the other, but didn't know I needed too.
susanep
Yup, that's me too, Susan!! It's one or the other and it can drive me CRAZY!!! :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Quote from: quietdynamics on February 23, 2014, 03:35:11 AM
Along with what Irish posted have you been Rx'd Salagen, pilocarpine or such.
I have been on Pilocarpine for the past "10" years. I just now started my diet and have been drinking much more water. Unfortunately, I've had this problem for quite some time. It's not so much that my stools are hard. In fact, it's much looser than necessary. It's just that it seems to get stuck in the middle.... YUCK.... ::)
Hi all,
In the spirit of this thread, Happy Pooping to all today!! I am new and adjusting to all this information I have recently realized the absence (or decrease) in saliva was likely the culprit in swallowing and hoarseness. Then I started thinking about my stomach acids. I have taken Prilosec or Nexium for about 20 years for GERD. I thought, I probably don't have enough normal mucous in my stomach to produce the normal amount of acid. Now...after reading this thread, I am finally down to the colon.
The one difference between all of you is ...I believe that is accurate...all of your posts voice constipation issues.. .I drink Citrucel every morning. I know we aren't supposed to promote stuff...but I think of this as telling you my experience...and can't do that without naming the product. About 20 years ago I saw my first gastroenterologist. He told me I had reflux. So he scopes me...and we saw it simultaneously on the screen: an ulcer. It was a NSAID ulcer. (yes..the perimeter can help differentiate ulcers.) He (we) sealed it with medication. A year later he rescoped...all sealed..a mild blemish...and he says he STILL believes I have reflux. I will say this, the Prilosec made me feel like a Medrol pack makes me feel today!! When I had initially seen him I referred to my irregularity and a couple of severe gastric episodes resulting in bloody diarrhea. He dx me with IBS. I hadn't had a colonoscopy at that point. So he adds Citrucel to my daily regime. At that time other than an antihistamine, the Prilosec was my one daily med. (oh..remember all...20 years ago I was in menopause...everything goes haywire during menopause!)
The Citrucel constipated me. I was leaving on a trip with three friends. The gastro told me to drink a citrate drink which I cannot recall the name. I found it at the drugstore. They were about 6 oz bottles. This helped after about three days. Problem solved.
I have the colonoscopy...NOTHING...nothing noted at all. So..all better??? NO. About 6 months later I return to the dr with the ongoing constipation issues. He begs me to try Citrucel again. He said, "take it for a month...regularly...and then call me. He said he bet I would be the Citrucel queen after one month." He was right.
In all those years I have missed no more than 10 days with this miracle FOR ME. He stated (I am repeating..so do not know if this is true...but he is the doctor) the Citrucel worked with the colon. He compared it to popular "laxative" drinks which had psyllium seeds in them which "did the work" for your colon. In other words, your colon retained its muscle usage with the Citrucel. That sounds strange...hope you get the gist. This was a doctor who was having digestion problems in high school...and when finishing medical school he said it was a no brainer for him in choosing a specialization. He said in the 10 years since his first problems, he had acquired many more. I always thought he should have been in research!
Take this info as something to discuss with your physicians. I do not advise taking anything I am recommending outside lip balm. It's just my story and my success with a product.
btw: I do NOT have IBS or IBD. I have had three "Crohn's like" attacks (no diagnosis for any of them..."colitis" [which of course all of you know doesn't stand alone: ULCERATIVE colitis is the real name.] ) I was 35, 44, and 65 when I had these three attacks. Colonoscopy after only one of the attacks. NOTHING showed up. Nothing.
Have a great, "relieved" day.
I'm glad this topic was brought up too.
I have the exact same issues as susanap. I have to pee frequently and then all of a sudden I'm going number 2 with no warning. And almost always incomplete emptying.
I had been constipated badly for about 1 1/2 years (starting about 8 mos before my sjogrens diagnosis) which I attributed to going on cymbalta.
Then I went to Mexico in December and got a touch of travellers diarrhea, which at first I actually welcomed as I wasn't constipated. But I still have loose stools and incomplete emptying almost 3 mos later, despite taking probiotics.
It's getting intolerable with bloating, gas, and unpredictable urgency and the runs.
I'm going to my pcp to see if it's still the travellers diarrhea or getting into IBS. I read that travellers diarrhea can trigger IBS. Or maybe I already had it before.
I hope you find some answers, Barrie.
Quote from: daisymae on February 23, 2014, 11:03:38 AM
I'm glad this topic was brought up too.
I have the exact same issues as susanap. I have to pee frequently and then all of a sudden I'm going number 2 with no warning. And almost always incomplete emptying.
I had been constipated badly for about 1 1/2 years (starting about 8 mos before my sjogrens diagnosis) which I attributed to going on cymbalta.
Then I went to Mexico in December and got a touch of travellers diarrhea, which at first I actually welcomed as I wasn't constipated. But I still have loose stools and incomplete emptying almost 3 mos later, despite taking probiotics.
It's getting intolerable with bloating, gas, and unpredictable urgency and the runs.
I'm going to my pcp to see if it's still the travellers diarrhea or getting into IBS. I read that travellers diarrhea can trigger IBS. Or maybe I already had it before.
I hope you find some answers, Barrie.
Thanks, daisymae..... If it weren't for forums such as this, I would NEVER have the answers that I'm looking for. Unfortunately, my rheumatologist never really examines me like he probably should. The fact of the matter being, he rarely changes his treatment and that's not good. When I complain of painful glands he just takes it for granted and says and DOES nothing!! It really rubs me the wrong way!!
Oh Barrie,
Another Rheumatologist who is resigning......
The thing is that they ignore things because they do not KNOW. So much more mature to say,
"well I understand that your glands are sore, and that could be from Sjogren's (if that's your diagnosis). Let's write it down now, keep track of it, and if it doesn't resolve in X amount of time, we can consider some tests.
We don't know everything with autoimmune conditions, Barrie, and there is some discomfort that is part of the condition, and doesn't respond particularly to additional treatment, if there are additional treatments.
I know it is hard to be uncomfortable, have you tried a pain reliever? Track your symptoms, and if they continue we can discuss this at our next visit."
This would 1) validate you 2) establish a method of tracking symptoms 3) establish a time-line for further action.
Now you just feel dismissed as a whiner, without even a consideration of what you've expressed and are experiencing. Honestly, these doctors just need some good manners!
Oh well. That's how I feel about it. I really do think lots of doctors don't like to deal with women who are sick in a chronic way......I think it is 'mother issues' myself.
Hugs, Elaine
That issue of constipation is not specific to Sjogren's nor with connective tissue autoimmune disease. Yes, there is some overlap with possible slow transit and lack of moisture.
But I've found that the biggest cause of constipation in those with autoimmunity is gut dysbiosis. It is basically an imbalance of gut flora resulting from antibiotics, anti-inflammatories, and other medications you've been on for years. It might show up the same time you're diagnosed with Sjogren's. Or it might predate your Sjogren's. Or it might show up much later after the onset. But gut dysbiosis is as common to autoimmunity as leaky gut is.
The reason why gut dysbiosis is common is that if it wasn't involved in kickstarting autoimmunity to begin with, by contributing to intestinal permeability, you might have developed it much later with the medications frequently prescribed to treat it. If you have Bristol Chart 1-3 and various other symptoms of constipation, then you probably have gut dysbiosis. Those other symptoms are: slow transit, lack of peristalsis, lack of moisture, stool density, etc. But you need certain gut bacteria species (Bacteroides) to give moisture to your stool and hold your stool together, not separate it like rabbit droppings.
The cure is to restore balance to your gut flora by taking probiotics and prebiotics. The most effective therapy, especially if you've had constipation characterized by pellet stool (Bristol Chart 1), is to take prebiotics to prime your gut flora and then probiotics. The easiest option is to take the cheapest and most available commercially available prebiotic in the form of resistant starch (RS); you may not even need probiotics since it feeds the gut bacteria that may have been under pressure from pathogenic bacteria.
You can read about gut dysbiosis and the RS therapy to restore normal BM right here:
http://freetheanimal.com/2013/12/resistant-primer-newbies.html
I like simple answers.
I've noticed taking vitamin C to extremes can cause diarrhea. Eating a lot of fat can cause food to pass through the system quite quickly.
When experiencing the opposite problem of slow transit a bit of vitamin C and dietary or supplemental oils such as fish oil, evening primrose, flaxseed, or coconut oils on a daily basis can compensate for the problem in a natural and unobtrusive way.
Just be careful not to overdo them or you'll end up with the opposite problem. It's fairly easy to adjust your daily dosage until you find just the right balance for you.
Another reason that the gut can be influenced by an inappropriate bacterial growth has little to do with the antibiotics and everything to do with the sjogrens. With the sjogrens our saliva is decreased which in turn doesn't dilute the acid in the stomach. With this upset in acid balance the normal flora get all screwed up. We normally have around 700 bacteria in our mouth that is supposed to be there to help start the digestion of food and to keep the cavities away plus more things that I don't know about. Also bacteria are programmed to survive in a certain environment and the GI tract that is too acidy can kill off some of them.
This absence of saliva to dilute the the acid also contributes to the reflux. There are very very sjoggies who get by without getting reflux. Just the reflux and decrease in saliva alone sets our colon up for all kinds of strange events. When we eat fiber or take and laxative product with fiber we have to make sure to take more fluid as our intestinal tract operates differently than normal people and without extra fluid the fiber can make us constipated.
Also, there are many types of colitis and I think that having an autoimmune disease sets us up for colitis that isn't always easily diagnosed. My hubby has Celiac sprue since 1978 and was diagnosed with ulcerative colitis based on colon tissue biopsies only to have the biopsies done 10 years later with a change in diagnosis. He was told he has microscopic colitis ( I think that is correct) and that this is very common in people with celiac disease. It is really miserable and can upset your life plus cause bleeding, but it is not as destructive as the ulcerative colitis. I know that I have attacks of colitis at times and one time it lasted 4 months. Many years later my immunologist asked why they didn't give me any prednisone and I had no answer. The doc back then had no clue what it was and when I think back I can only think "why in the heck, didn't that doctor think autoimmune cause ulcerative colitis and autoimmune diseases have been around for a long time.".
Hope everyone is getting their gut in order!!!
Waldop, Yes, it is me!!!! I have been hanging around here for about 10 years now. I am one of the oldest ones on here and am still able to count to ten most days. Hope that you are doing ok. Just an update, I have been doing IVIG for 7 years for my myasthenia gravis and lt helps my low t-cells. I am also on prednisone, Plaquenil and just started the cellcept 2 months ago cause my myasthenia is getting worse--especially in the summer. Have had to take higher dosage of prednisone and the docs want me to get that dosage lower thus the cellcept. Take care all. Irish
Quote from: gurs on February 23, 2014, 04:17:44 AM
I have this issue..stomach just paralyzed..i have gastroparesis.
I think the neuro issues, muscle issues with sjogrens play a huge part.
I also learned that less fiber works better for me...too much can cause binding.
Ohhhhh, these stomachs. Seems so many of us have problems. Even as a child, I always had trouble.
I never got the "urge" to have a bowel movement...even back then, I had some gastroparesis, which I thought
was just constipation at the time.
Gursie
Thanks for your input, Gursie!! I couldn't agree more!! Truth be told, I've had stomach problems from the time I was born. I once told my gastro doctor,
"I was born with a bad stomach and I'll die with one!" He was a little ticked at me for having such an attitude. I'm a realist and I know what my body can tolerate and what it has difficult with, pure and simple.
I'm sorry to hear about the gastroparesis. I hear that can be awful!! :( You take care of yourself...
Barrie***
I also have that problem. I have tried softeners, laxatives, prunes and anything else I can think of. I would take up to three softeners a night. Nothing helped.
My primary care physician has tried different medications. He just put me on Linzess. It has been successful. I even feel better on it. Not as much backup and bloating.
This condition is not one of the fun parts of Sjogren's. :(
Jennifer
I think you're misunderstanding the concept. We're not talking about the bacteria in your mouth but the bacteria in your large intestine, which are the largest species of gut microbes found in the human body. Those bacterial species are unrelated to gut dysbiosis, which specifically refers to the imbalance of gut microbes in your large intestine, not in your mouth or in your small intestine. These are the bacteria which play a specific role in stool formation and peristalsis by giving volume and moisture to the stool, softening its passage through the lower digestive tract.
And the point regarding stomach acid and the GI tract is wrong. The pH level in the GI tract is completely different from the urinary pH or serum pH. Most beneficial bacteria thrive in acidic (i.e., low pH) conditions, not in an alkaline environment; that is exactly what butyrate does, lowers the pH of the large intestine through fermentation so that these beneficial bacteria can thrive. This has nothing to do with the serum acid-base balance which those in alternative medicine like to squawk about. And this has nothing to do with metabolic acidosis.
Quote from: irish on February 23, 2014, 10:39:12 PMAnother reason that the gut can be influenced by an inappropriate bacterial growth has little to do with the antibiotics and everything to do with the sjogrens. With the sjogrens our saliva is decreased which in turn doesn't dilute the acid in the stomach. With this upset in acid balance the normal flora get all screwed up. We normally have around 700 bacteria in our mouth that is supposed to be there to help start the digestion of food and to keep the cavities away plus more things that I don't know about. Also bacteria are programmed to survive in a certain environment and the GI tract that is too acidy can kill off some of them.
This absence of saliva to dilute the the acid also contributes to the reflux. There are very very sjoggies who get by without getting reflux. Just the reflux and decrease in saliva alone sets our colon up for all kinds of strange events. When we eat fiber or take and laxative product with fiber we have to make sure to take more fluid as our intestinal tract operates differently than normal people and without extra fluid the fiber can make us constipated.
Thank you for bringing light to this topic. Sadly it too is one of the many issues I have been battling. It is so frustrating and can make one feel so miserable. To have the urge, then sit for a prolonged amount of time for incomplete or no results. Increase in fluid consumption (I drink mostly water), reduced caffeine, whole grain foods, and all the fruits/veggies in the world have not helped at all!
Now it is even worse since removing all gluten type foods from my diet. High fiber, bulky foods aren't working.
I feel so bad that each of you experience the same, what a blessing it would be for all of us to have relief from this miserable disease and ask it's side effects.
Take care, Mary
This is all very interesting. And it makes a lot of sense to me from a layman's standpoint that AI and Sjogren's issues (especially as Irish with her medical knowledge posted) can have effects on our ability to move our bowels. I have had a problem since I was a child!
And yes, mine just gets "stuck" sometimes. I am sorry if this is too graphic, but I was at work one day recently and felt backed up but also sort of like I needed to try to go. Worked so hard at it! Was stuck in the bathroom for about 15 minutes, perspiring from all of the work - honestly. It wouldn't come out and it wouldn't go back in and it was hard as a rock. I FINALLY pushed hard enough and got it out. This is probably sounding funny to some and sort of gross to others. I had to laugh. I work at a hospital. I had visions of having to call someone to come help me get it out!!!! I hope this never happens again. But I get very close to it sometimes.
Thanks for all of the good information. I think I will buy some Citrucel. I remember using it years ago and it helped.
Yes LucyD, I have had to assist more than a few pts in my nursing career as well. Let's just say I never want to be on the receiving end of a soap suds enema, disimpacton or milk of mag cocktail we would give.
So frustrating!
Yes, I have had this issue for some time. I just started taking magnesium (100 mg) and potassium (99 mg) daily, on the advice on a Holistic pharmacist because I was searching for some muscle pain relief. The side effect I am getting is softer stools and regularity. It has helped my bloating and my stools now are smaller and softer. It literally has solved that problem for the time being.
Citrucel AND magnesium it will be. Might be nice to not feel so "backed up" too!! ;D >:(
Thanks.
Well lets just say lately I cant get it all out ::) Part of the problem is the meds I take, part of the problem is pelvic floor dysfunction. Who knew that muscles could atrophy in and around your nether regions ;D I guess my Dad was right when he said sitting too long would make me weak lol
So funny Tivia. Boy we have all had fun with this one.
Quote from: Tivia on March 18, 2014, 11:19:00 AM
Well lets just say lately I cant get it all out ::) Part of the problem is the meds I take, part of the problem is pelvic floor dysfunction. Who knew that muscles could atrophy in and around your nether regions ;D I guess my Dad was right when he said sitting too long would make me weak lol
My gastro doc and more recently the gastro surgeon are recommending physical therapy for my pelvic floor dysfunction. Biofeedback, don't know how that is going to work out as when initially recommended I had exhausted my annual outpatient rehab between lumbar spine, cervical spine and speech therapy last year. So gastro surgeon kicked back to gastro doc recommendation for physical therapy. Muscles still work but not correctly. Surgeon was unable to complete exam due to involuntary muscle spasms
But in my situation, more than sjogrens going on affecting bowels. Pending is whether MRI will be ordered for sacral spine. S2-4 nerves affect bowel function and no one MRI'd or even xrayed that part of my spine after that horrid fall in 2012, even tho I was clear that my sacral spine was the point of first contact with the floor in that fall.
Reading this thread with great interest....I have Sjogrens and never thought a lot about it. Had the standard dry mouth and dry eyes and didn't notice any improvement after taking Evoxac.... So I stopped and soon noticed I was having trouble passing stool...Went back to taking Evoxac and my physician also had me take metamucil at night and shortly the constipation ended.
Evoxac is now called cevimeline which I have been on for the past 6 months or so....Some weeks ago, constipation returned even with the added metamucil....Doc had me stop the metamucil and said to take Miralax instead, which I have been on now for about a week....Had some success (two or three very small movements a day) but now, as of yesterday, nothing...Total constipation again, even taking Miralax.
Am getting a lot more respect for the impact of Sjogrens...Didn't realize it would have such an effect on your intestines but I'm guessing it really must dry up your instestinal wall.
Have to go back and see what my physician suggests now....This is really getting frustrating!!!
Sjogrens produces a condition commonly known here as 'dry bum'. In the same way it impacts moisture producing glands such as tear ducts and salivary glands it can also impede the glands in the intestines which produce mucus to keep stool moist and help it along.
Eating a lot of dry or paste producing foods such as dry peanuts or saltines can make it worse. Much worse.
Eating fats lubricates the stool and helps it slide out. A tablespoon of coconut oil a day, either in food, or by itself, is a good way to accomplish this. This can work a lot better than using fiber because fiber can push on dry, stuck stools causing a lot of discomfort to outright pain.
Put a little slide in your glide.
QuotePut a little slide in your glide.
LOL...that one phrase sure tickled my funny bone. ;D ;D
You could possibly have a rectocele have you been assessed for one by your OBGYN or Gasteroenterologist.
Just a thought!?!
The muscles in the lower pelvis get very weak for many reasons. This can be from a lot of lifting, childbearing, autoimmune disease (collagen disease--short explanation is the glue that holds the cells/tissues together does't work as well) plus the neuropathy that can also accompany all of the above.
Your OB/GYN needs to know about this as there are exercises that may help some people---do a search on Kegel for explanation. Then when all else fails it seems that some people aren't ill but they just seem to have less tone in their muscles and it is just the way there bodies are made. Makes for a miserable situation from time to time. Good luck all. Irish
Hope you are feeling much better now?
I had a blockage and impaction recently and was prescribed Laxido sachets. It took about ten sachets to clear the blockage and I now take one or two a day which does seem to help. I now have them on repeat prescription but I would rather be taking something more natural - I used to get by with Slippery Elm and Aloe Vera but they just weren't helping any more. Even glycerin suppositories (horrid things) which I tried in desperation were no use as the blockage was much higher up. A gluten and dairy free diet helped my bowel issues for years but not any more sadly :( Back to the drawing board. ;)
If people are having problems emptying their bladder/bowels one should always check into the drugs they are taking. There are drugs that have anticholinergic effects and they can just raise havoc with nerve response and bladder emtying in some people. Talk with your doc about this. Pilocarpine is one drug that can cause some issues though it does't bother as much as some of the other drugs.
Some of the psych drugs can have this effect also. It is something that you should not make a decision about until you talk with your doc. Sometimes it can be the fact that more than one anticholinergic drug is being taken. Irish
I became super constipated as my Sjogren's progressed and attacked more and more of my moisture-producing glands. Although, I felt like I had to go, I too was unable to push it out. My stomach was so painful and extended that I thought something more serious was going on. Spoke to my Rheumy who told me Sjogren's definitely causes your bum to be dry, making it harder to pass stools, and she suggested a capful and a half of Miralax every morning. Unlike Benefiber and other fiber meds which cause a lot of gas, Miralax softens/moistens the stool so it is more easily passed. Took about 2 weeks to really get things going, but I've been very regular since and I seldom miss a day of taking it because I don't want to go back to where I was. Also, if I don't have a bowel movement for whatever reason for one or two days at the most, I use a glycerin suppository (like Fleet) in the morning to help with getting things moving. Works like a charm.
Hope everyone finds relief!
Maria