I was having a TCD done (brain ultrasound) and the woman stuck me 4 times and never got blood. I have GREAT veins too. There's a 2 stick rule for those who don't know (my mom used to be a phlebotomist.) On the 3rd stick it hurt so bad and sent a shooting, numb, funny bone feeling from the needle all the way down to in between my fingers. I screamed out and said "owwww!" She didn't stop..she pulled back a hair and started "fishing" going from side to side, angling it different ways but not before going over to my other arm for a 4th try! I told her "there's a 2 stick rule go get someone else" and she said there is no one else...I'm it...you're stuck with me. That was on the 3rd. I'm increasingly getting worse with feelings of no circulation (arm feels dead like when your foot falls asleep), pins and needles, feeling like I hit my funny bone constantly, numbness and tingling etc. Nerve damage. I think the doctor is really scared about a lawsuit because she wanted me to wait 6 more days before coming in! We hung up and 2 minutes later my phone rang and it was here again but this time doctor wanted to see me TOMORROW (as in today now that it's past midnight.) They are going to ultrasound me. From what me and mom have read, that's not gonna show crap. Which is probably why they're doing it so they THINK they can be clear of any wrongdoing. It happens to be my left arm and hand and I'm left handed so I hope it doesn't get any worse than it already is...like "claw hand." I will bring a lawsuit against them. Whenever a patient yells out, it's protocol to remove the needle, not fish and say sorry but keep going. Also I had 4 big a@# holes in my arm but not a drop of blood and my mom said that's because she was never in the vein and she hit my nerve and damaged it. For instance, typing this message, every time my left hand hits a key, it feels like I banged my funny bone. The incompetence of people is unbelievable.
OUCH, OUCH, OUCH - I felt like I was in that chair having blood drawn with you.
I hope it's a temporary nerve damage. I googled "nerve damage from phlebotamy" and found many articles and law suits.
Bless your heart. Yes, she never should have fished for sure!
I had someone hit the ulnar nerve while starting an IV for a CT scan a couple years ago. It hurt something fierce. I hope this doesn't upset you more, but mine took over 11 months to heal...I kid you not. I would have the 'zing' from the funny bone with just a simple movement of my arm. I immediately called the radiologist mgr and filed a formal complaint, and they monitored the damage for months as nerve damage takes a long time to heal. I am on blood thinners and there was extensive bleeding in the area so it slowed the healing process down. I took pictures because I was afraid it would not heal.
Good news was that it did eventually heal...just took a LONG time. So hope yours does as well. But you should document names and details of the event in case it doesn't. Also see a doctor and document the visit.
You have my deepest sympathy! The "sticker" was definitely wrong and should have stopped. I had a bad experience myself but nothing like yours. I KNOW my veins are good because everyone I've asked since says I'm easy. The bad experience left me a huge black and blue mark on my left arm and I had it crooked for over a week before I could un-painfully straighten it out. Thankfully the job I had it for started after that week or I could have never worked.
I would sue, threaten to sue, or sure yell a lot if I was in your place.
PS: I learned later that that place wasn't a good one to "get stuck" at. They had a reputation which I didn't know about. Never went there again.
Very sorry to hear this! I know exactly what that feels like!!
I had a blood bank (I think it was Red Cross) screw up the nerve in my arm a long time ago. I would not let anyone draw blood from that arm for about 20+ yrs. Now it is OK.
Document, Document, Document. Have someone take pictures on a weekly basis of different positions of fingers, etc. grasp. Go to a neurologist and have them do a EMG to check out your nerve function as they can isolate the nerve and the percentage of usability.
Let your doc know for sure that this is not going away and file a complaint. It is no fun to have to sue, and much of the time it is for naught. Real and irreparable damage has to be proven in most cases. I had a similar thing one time with my IVIG. The nurse tried to use the vein that runs sort of up and over my thumb and I had bad shooting nerve pain for months. Finally went away, but I have not allowed them to use that vein again. Good luck. IRISH
I will tell you that when I had my head injury back in 1964 I was in the hospital and a student nurse gave me an injection in my butt muscle. As the product was being pushed through the needle I had sharp shooting pains in my hip and down my leg. I told them and nothing was of any concern I guess. A few months after I finished nurses training I started having nerve pain down my hip into my ankle on that side. I really was miserable with it and spent a lot of my off time laying on cold or warm on the couch.
I finally went to the doctor and he told me he thought that the injection I was given did not hit the nerve, but was right next to the nerve and pressed against it. He told me to take Vitamin B complex as that would help with the healing process. I do think it helped a lot. I have had problems with that hip and sciatica for much of my life. The good thing is that it goes away. Also, I have learned that whether I went to to he doctor or not the pain and misery usually left in 6 weeks or so. Not that yours will, but the nerves are very stragne things. Good luck. Irish
Do Not Pass Go, Do Not Collect $200.......REPORT THEM TO YOUR INSURANCE PROVIDER.
If you have Medicare, all the better......Medicare has been great about my recent complaints.
1-800-MEDICARE
How absolutely infuriating. Sounds like you had an incompetent.
I don't have good veins and often have to show em where to stick me, to warm area first, to get someone else.
If they are poking around inside like that they suck, whether you have good veins or bad veins.
So sorry Gary, hope it resolves quickly and doesn't to turn into a chronic or ongoing issue for you.
Dee
Dee: thank you. I'm leaving shortly to go to the neuro to have an ultrasound done. I'm sure it'll be "normal" because they're not going to admit to any wrongdoing.
SjoAmy: I'm sure he'll bill my insurance the FULL amount even though HALF the test was done. I'll call BCBS and tell them to be on the lookout and to not pay the whole thing.
irish: good idea. we've already started the process of documenting. I'm going to audio record this appt in case I need proof of anything. I have a feeling he'll say "this doesn't happen from IV's or blood draws" which is total BS.
jazzlover: thank you. I can imagine not letting anyone touch you for 20+ years. It's very scary.
pisces24: I'm going to sue if possible and also threaten to sue. I think they are already scared. I'm not even sure she's qualified to do what she did. She didn't even use a tourniquet and she taught someone who works there how to hook up EEG's but he has NO DEGREE etc. He was taught by HER. I'm going to ask the neuro if she's qualified to do IV's/draw blood.
Amanda: thank you and I know, right? More drama! I have "beautiful veins" in the words of several phlebotomists. My best friend works for Quest and she's appalled at the stories I tell her!
anita: thank you for your response. it doesn't upset me. just knowing it'll get better (or that it's possible) is good enough for me. 11 months is a long time and everyone is different but I'll be lucky if I don't lose function of my arm. So I'd take an 11 month recovery no problem. Sorry you had such a bad experience too.
Velcro: yes for sure. Thing is no one should have to fish because my veins are like BAM! They pop like I don't know what! Especially when I'm hot, warm, after a shower etc. No excuse to ever miss! and 4 times at that! She never even hit the vein because not one drop of blood came out and no bruises either.
Skylar: thank you and yes, googling this search term will pull up a lot of horror stories and lawsuit stories. My mom was researching last night. It's crazy!
Been thinking of my MANY phlebotomy experiences.....ya know in times like you had that day, I have actually removed my arm from the needle. Not recommended really, happens more by instinct with the sheer amount of pain in an episode like that.
Most insurance carriers have a quality control complaint department. Utilize it. You're not the only one.
I am going to address this from a different aspect and you probably aren't going to like it. What I am going to say does bear consideration though.
I worked in the medical business for over 40 years and learned a lot along the way. I also have learned a lot being a patient and having my hubby be a patient also. At one point we visited with a lawyer about a potential lawsuit and learned that our particular situation would not be worth the time and effort.
It should be noted that people who sue doctors often have great trouble over the years obtaining a doctor and keeping a doctor. Reason being: you will have a reputatioin as a person who sued a doctor and especially if you won. Doctors will be scared silly to take you as a patient because they have such horribly high malpractice insurance the way it is and to take on a patient who has sued a doc and especially if you have won. Not fair, I know, but that is the way it is. There is no way that you will prove that doctors are avoiding you as there are ways to not take on new patients.
The one thing people often do is to get any medical issues paid for by the hospital/clinic, etc. Also, the best thing you can do it to keep this quiet in your own community cause gossip can really ruin you for further medical care also. I know this sounds cruel, but this is the way of the world. The best thing you can do is to complain to the hospital and try to get rid of that tech. If they won't fire her the least they can do is do inservice and more training. She sounds like a loser to me.
I had some stuff happen to me that I would have loved to sue for. Involved some big time docs, etc but there was no way I could have won. You also have to consider the cost, time involved and pain and suffering of being involved with a lawsuit. It can literally ruin a persons marriage and life. Just my input from observing all these years. Irish
Irish,
How does a doctor know if a patient sued? Do doctors run legal searches on every patient?
Amanda,
I don't think she's qualified to even do what she's doing. I read some reviews on website and one woman injected her with saline solution into her muscle and when she screamed out in pain, she didn't stop. I asked Dr. M if she was even qualified and he said "I think so." You THINK so? There was this kid in there around my age...said he had cerebral palsy. Funny thing is...he only had damage on one side...his left. Otherwise he looked, appeared normal. I GUARANTEE he has nerve damage and is too blind to realize it. Something shady is going on there because he ALWAYS his his nurse present when you have your office visit. They "border" on a pain clinic and I think it's a joke.
SjoAmy: it probably won't get me anywhere but it doesn't hurt to try.
irish: I know you're right. Docs won't go against each other but it's not going to stop me from trying. I don't even think she's qualified to do what she's doing. I doubt she has training (proper) or a phlebotomy certificate etc. It's probably one of those money crunch, office worker turned phlebotomist with training on Friday and drawing blood by Monday with no real experience of qualifications. I know these suits are hard to prove but I'm still contacting an attorney. I fear you're right and it won't get me anywhere but I have to try. I'm tired of people F'ing up my body and life and NOT having to pay for it.
As for how doctors know: I have not sued anyone, but I have changed doctors for one reason or another, many times over 17 years of dealing with this stuff. Patients are not required to give details (or even asked) why they left another doctor. Unless you go to someone within the same group (as the one you sue), then it just doesn't seem that easy. Of course doctors talk, but they have to know who to talk to. Unless it made the news, how would they know who to talk to?
I was seriously wondering, if they run checks on new patients to see if they have any legal public records.
I haven't had the lawsuit thing, but so far, I've had no issues changing Doctors AND telling them why when they asked. My new Rheumy asked me if I had ever seen a Rheumy. I answered that I had, 2 years prior and since I was giving him copies of my medical records, he would have known anyway. He asked me who it was and why I changed. I told him the Doctors name and told him I was very disappointed because he looked at my arm and mumbled something in German about it being very strange, ran blood work and then said, "Come back in zee year and we will zee if there is anything else that shows up!" Didn't have a bedside manner and I didn't feel he even attempted to figure it out. He shook his head as soon as I said the Doctor's name and said, "I don't blame you." It was obvious from his attitude about it, I wasn't the first one to tell him about that Doctor.
The new PCP I tried wasn't phased either when I told her I was looking for a new PCP that knew more about autoimmunes in general and that I was disappointed to find out I had some positive test results that he never told me about. She did the same thing, as in nodded and has been wonderful.
Neither one of them dogged the Doctor, but I think if you get a good Doctor, they recognize just like we do that there is good and bad in every profession.
You will have trouble seeing another doc in the same practice because the docs in the practice won't take patients away from another doc as a professional courtesy since they are all part of the same practice. Going to a different group shouldn't be a problem unless you have a reputation of being a "difficult patient". And yes, doctors do talk, they run across each other all the time and will often give indications if a patient has litigious tendencies.
You should be able to find out if the tech has the proper credentials to perform her job, I concur with what Irish has said about perusing that so this can be prevented, and get the medical care that might be needed for the nerve injury covered rather than perusing lawsuits at this time. Any reputable doctor, clinic, hospital would try to do this for incidents like this.
Nancy
Yes,there is some truth in what Irish said BUT....
1) It's a personal decision. People like us don't have an easy time getting or keeping docs because of the "complications" of our case. That being said there comes a point to where a person becomes fed up with the occurrences of the system. No one else can decide that for them.
2) Is it easy? No. But anything working toward for is rarely ever easy. Lawyers will most times take cost out of winnings....50% to you, 50% to them. So if you won for $2 M, you get $1 M. Not bad really. I have a friend that is getting her lumbar surgery after suing her company for 3 years, because the company originally did not want to cover the on-the-job injury and without their admission she couldn't get company insurance to cover costs. She got 300,000 from them and costs of surgery and 2 years of recovery costs covered.
Will she have a hard time getting a doctor in the future, likely more than not.
Sometimes you just gotta do what is right for you. Despite other people penalizing you for it or not.
Again, only you can make that call.....when is enough, really enough.
I have managed to put together 5 YEARS WORTH of Malpractices & Negligence together.....now I am doing something about it. Someone has to show them this is wrong to do to people. Only you can know what method of justice is right for you.
It is correct to say that only you can make the decision and the choice to pursue a lawsuit. I wsd just stating the other side of the issue.
Never, never think that people don't talk. There are all kinds of meetings locally, statewide and nationally in every specialty and doctors talk and talk and talk. Then there are the meetings for the nurses, meetings for housekeeping, meetings for dietary, you name it there is a meeting going on and the medical community talks just like any other business, etc.
This doesn't mean that lay people know all about a lawsuit, but you would easily find someone on the street who is knowledgeable. This is just the way life is and we have to be aware of it. Also, lawyers talk to each other. There is nothing sacred on this earth the minute it passes someones lips or occurs in some way, shape or form. Irish
Never mind lips......we have the speed of the internet....web or email.....faster than jumping jack flash lol.
When my financial lawyer tells me that what happened to me is worth pursuing, I have more faith than that of laymen.
Yes, hospitals & doctors are a business.....but the majority that I have encountered since my autoimmune problems surfaced......could use a course in what it takes to run a successful and reputable business. And that is putting it mildly.