Hi,
I am new to the Forum. My name is Linda and I am 59 years old.
I just had all my teeth surgically removed 3 weeks ago due to Sjorgens Syndrome.
I have secondary as I have rheumatoid arthritis, Crohns disease, ankylosing spondylitis, Sjorgens, Raynauds, fibromyalgia, GERD, glaucoma, psoriatric arthritis. My mother also had Sjorgens but they obviously didn?t know what it was when all her teeth were ruined and removed in 1950. She did have dentures all her life. She always complained of ?cotton mouth? and getting sores, which I now know was dry mouth. If they had implants back then she would have gotten them. She did not have as many auto-immune diseases that i have. My son who is 38 has ankylosing spondylitis and IBD.
The only way I could pay to have my teeth removed after years of getting crowns and root canals done was to let our house go into foreclosure. I had to save the money that had been for house payments for the removal and anesthesia.
I have lost 30 lbs in 3 weeks even though I am drinking and pureeing the foods I can eat. My Crohns affects what foods I can eat also.
My oral surgeon says it will take six months for my gums, jaw, bone, etc. to heal completely before she can install the implants. I am getting 5 or 6 on top and 3 on the bottom and having some sort of an appliance made for both top and bottom that snaps onto the titanium implants. It will be removable for cleaning and for my comfort if needed.
I am a bit worried after reading some Drs. state that implants don't always work or aren?t good but I am only 59 years old and I hope to live a couple more decades. LOL I am craving chewing real food and am depressed and being treated for that anyways.
I think I have to take the chance to get the implants although it is going to cost me another $27,000 for them and the appliances. Our insurance/medical will not pay anything towards this as it is dental even though it is caused by a disease that they pay for other issues that occur in my body like my Dry eye and dry skin/dermatology.
My dental insurance only pays $1,000 a year.
We are renting now a very cheap house so we can save as much as we can and try to save the implant amount in 5 months at $2200 per implant. Then wait another 6 months for the bone to bond to the implants and get the appliances.
This is a terrible and very frustrating disease. And I have alot of diseases but sometimes I think this is the worst. I have been on Remicade for over 8 years and haven't had it since August due to having the oral dental surgery. I am going back on Remicade again this Thursday as my RA has gotten very bad. I am just hoping it works again. I do not take steroids due to a cataract I got from being on prednisone for 3 years.
Is there anyone here who has had to have all their teeth removed?
I have temporary dentures that were made but now don't fit due to
longer swelling and spreading of ridge due to them having trouble removing the root canals in most of my molars.
Plus just about everything I read says Sjorgen people usually cannot wear dentures. Although I know there is always those that do.
I have very bad Sjorgens with no saliva hardly, serious dry eye, skin drying to look like alligator skin.
The temporary dentures were to give me something to wear to go out in public but as I said, I can't wear them.
I hope there is someone out there who has perhaps had an experience like mine and can tell me more about it.
Thank you.
Linda
Don't know how to add info at bottom so will type it now.
Sjorgens Syndrome, Rheumatoid Arthritis, Crohns Disease, Ankylosing Spondylitis, Fibro, Raynauds, Psoriatric Arthritis, GERD, Glaucoma, Liver damage from Methotrexate, slightly high blood pressure.
Meds taking now: Remicade IV, Protonix, Paxil, Klonopin, Restasis, Xalatan, Systane Ultra, Losartan, Questran, Oxycodone, Morphine
Hi,
I am new to the Forum. My name is Linda and I am 59 years old.
I just had all my teeth surgically removed 3 weeks ago due to Sjorgens Syndrome.
I have secondary as I have rheumatoid arthritis, Crohns disease, ankylosing spondylitis, Sjorgens, Raynauds, fibromyalgia, GERD, glaucoma, psoriatric arthritis. My mother also had Sjorgens but they obviously didn?t know what it was when all her teeth were ruined and removed in 1950. She did have dentures all her life. She always complained of ?cotton mouth? and getting sores, which I now know was dry mouth. If they had implants back then she would have gotten them. She did not have as many auto-immune diseases that i have. My son who is 38 has ankylosing spondylitis and IBD.
The only way I could pay to have my teeth removed after years of getting crowns and root canals done was to let our house go into foreclosure. I had to save the money that had been for house payments for the removal and anesthesia.
I have lost 30 lbs in 3 weeks even though I am drinking and pureeing the foods I can eat. My Crohns affects what foods I can eat also.
My oral surgeon says it will take six months for my gums, jaw, bone, etc. to heal completely before she can install the implants. I am getting 5 or 6 on top and 3 on the bottom and having some sort of an appliance made for both top and bottom that snaps onto the titanium implants. It will be removable for cleaning and for my comfort if needed.
I am a bit worried after reading some Drs. state that implants don't always work or aren?t good but I am only 59 years old and I hope to live a couple more decades. LOL I am craving chewing real food and am depressed and being treated for that anyways.
I think I have to take the chance to get the implants although it is going to cost me another $27,000 for them and the appliances. Our insurance/medical will not pay anything towards this as it is dental even though it is caused by a disease that they pay for other issues that occur in my body like my Dry eye and dry skin/dermatology.
My dental insurance only pays $1,000 a year.
We are renting now a very cheap house so we can save as much as we can and try to save the implant amount in 5 months at $2200 per implant. Then wait another 6 months for the bone to bond to the implants and get the appliances.
This is a terrible and very frustrating disease. And I have alot of diseases but sometimes I think this is the worst. I have been on Remicade for over 8 years and haven't had it since August due to having the oral dental surgery. I am going back on Remicade again this Thursday as my RA has gotten very bad. I am just hoping it works again. I do not take steroids due to a cataract I got from being on prednisone for 3 years.
Is there anyone here who has had to have all their teeth removed?
I have temporary dentures that were made but now don't fit due to
longer swelling and spreading of ridge due to them having trouble removing the root canals in most of my molars.
Plus just about everything I read says Sjorgen people usually cannot wear dentures. Although I know there is always those that do.
I have very bad Sjorgens with no saliva hardly, serious dry eye, skin drying to look like alligator skin.
The temporary dentures were to give me something to wear to go out in public but as I said, I can't wear them.
I hope there is someone out there who has perhaps had an experience like mine and can tell me more about it.
Thank you.
Linda
Don't know how to add info at bottom so will type it now.
Sjorgens Syndrome, Rheumatoid Arthritis, Crohns Disease, Ankylosing Spondylitis, Fibro, Raynauds, Psoriatric Arthritis, GERD, Glaucoma, Liver damage from Methotrexate, Depression/Anxiety, slightly high blood pressure.
Meds taking now: Remicade IV, Protonix, Paxil, Klonopin, Restasis, Xalatan, Systane Ultra, Losartan, Questran, Oxycodone, Morphine
Wow and I thought I has teeth issues. I've lost two molars in the past few months and am getting another one filled and crowned today. I've read about quite a few people on here that have gotten dentures and are thrilled with them. Couldn't you try to get a better pair of dentures before spending so much on implants? Just a thought.
Hi Linda - welcome! :) There's a wealth of information here as confused mentioned. We're a worldwide group that have Sjogrens in common . . aren't we the lucky ones?! ::) Actually, we are lucky - in the sense we have this forum where we can meet others that share the journey so we don't feel so alone as we figure out this disease called Sjogrens. When you come here, please remember, we get it! ;) I hope you find this site helpful to you on your Sjogrens journey.
I am one of the ones who had all my teeth pulled three years ago and wear dentures. When I had them pulled, the dentures went in immediately (as in, I walked out the door with them already in place). They put them in immediately to help reduce the swelling.
It was a little tough the first few times taking them out and trying to get them back in - but, once I got used to it, it's a piece of cake.
I didn't opt for the implants for a couple of reasons. 1) The cost. 2) My mother had a difficult time with implants where they wouldn't hold and they would fall out, etc. and I didn't want to go that route. For myself, I would hate to go through that huge expense and then find out they wouldn't work for me and then have to resort to dentures after all.
Dentures aren't a problem for me (once they tweek and fine tune the fit - which is normal for new dentures).
I'm so thankful not to have all the trips to the dentist any more for fillings or caps, plus no more pain from infections or my teeth just crumbling for no reason at all.
If you were to just meet me - you wouldn't know that my teeth aren't the ones I was born with. ;D
Good Luck.
Bucky
HI Linda:
What a brave woman you are and so much on your plate too!
I also have been suffering from Sjogren's doing a big assault on my teeth as well for many years. I have only a few of my real teeth left and the rest are a combination of all sorts of things including dental implants and bridges hanging off of dental implants.
Let me first say that I see a wonderful dentist for regular upkeep of my dental issues, but when I need to get something done with the implants or the bridges, I go and see a Prostetic Dentist who specializes in these things and at the same time doesn't charge any more than my regular dentist does for the work. The reason I decided to go and see the Prostetic Dentist is that that's what he does all day and so he is an expert on all of the tricks of the trade. My regular dentist while very good, only does an implant once in a while and a full mouth tooth replacement rarely.
Ok, now to respond to some of your questions. I've had nothing but really good luck with my implants. I have had some for 6 years now without any issues. I did have to have bone grafts done to build up a number of areas in my mouth before the implants where placed though, but all of those went really well too. I would just advise you to make sure you have a really good expert do the work and to assess exactly where the implants need to go so that you get the best bang for your Bite!
Also if your dentist knows his business, he should have told you that implants placed in the 2nd molar position are less successful than other implants. I say this in case some of the implants you are getting may be considered for placement there. You should also ask what happens if something doesn't work out, what is the guarantee policy or replacement policy etc...
Best of luck and you may wish to look into Ensure liquid meal replacement products if you haven't already to help with the weight loss. You might also want to consult a dietician who should have the skinny on anything new on the market that you could injest that would help you get all of the calories and nutrients you need.
Sending you many hugs,
Daisy
Dearest Linda,
My heart goes out to you. If I had MY way everyone would have automatic dental and health care.
But I don't have my way.
I know there are quite a few who have lost all their teeth due to Sjogren's.
I don't know about the implant appliances, however. I've only heard of teeth implanted. Are the appliances used to anchor dentures, bridges and other dental objects?
Hugs and more hugs.
Hang in there.
Keep us posted, too, please.
Elaine
Welcome to the forum.
Welcome to the forum. I guess I will be one of the people who will try to discourage you from doing the implants. The reason I am so leary of the implants is because many people with autoimmune diseases also develop immune diseases or diseases that affect their ability to heal or fight off infection.
I have autoimmune diseases (sjogrens, myasthenia gravis, bullous pemphigoid, hashimotos) and I also have severely low t-cells which puts me at high risk of infection. I had a terrible time with my teeth and it took me about 16 years to get them to pull what was left. I had so many abscesses and root canals and then would have to have the tooth pulled. I had probably 60% of my teeth pulled before I had the rest extracted and got dentures.
I have never, ever been sorry that I have dentures. I had them pulled about 7 years ago and am able to eat everything except caramels. I eat corn on the cob, pop corn, etc. I use Polydent adhesive to hold them in and it is no problem.
Now days there are better way to make impressions for dentures and there are better ways to deal with the dentures if they are rubbing and making sores. I have had a few of those sores, but between the dentist and me we figured out how to deal with it.
I just want you to know that anytime you drill into the bone you cause bacteria to enter the area and the chances of infection can be increased. Now days we can't always be sure that antibiotics will kill off infection as many of the bacteria are resistant to the antibiotics. An infection in the bone or jaw is called osteomyelitis and can be extremely hard to get rid of and can even be life threatening. Just to let you know that this is not anything to rush into. Besides the expense I don't think that the implants are worth the risk. Thankfully, I refused to even consider the implants cause I didn't know I had the high risk of infection until a few years after my teeth were pulled.
Sometimes I even will have a pain in my jaw/tooth and I have to remind myself that my teeth are false. I also brush my teeth without any toothbrush at times when they are in my mouth. Don't use regular toothpaste on the dentures though cause it is too abrasive. Hope you are able to think this through and consider the fact that dentures are a lot safer and cheaper in the long run. Irish ;D
Hi, and welcome. My heart goes out to you. I'm also a newbie, and while I'm not at the point where I'm forced to make a decision about implants or dentures, I'm well on my way. I have several crowns, in need of root canals (had one of those already), and my teeth are crumbling almost daily. This disease is humbling to say the least.
I was pleased to read the above positive experiences with dentures, as I personally feel as though having them would be a dream come true. I don't understand (admittedly, I'm certainly not an expert on the subject), why would we, who can't produce what we need to take care of our own teeth, go through the pain and rashes of dental care, only to painfully instal yet another set of problems?
As Irish mentioned above, the bacteria being placed in your system, through your bone, is a very real and serious threat. I've read convincing studies, with evidence of rotting teeth bacteria, actually being the cause of several diseases, including cancer. I've often wondered if my teeth have contributed to my autoimmune problems.
At any rate, you are in a horrible situation, and I'll be praying that you make the best decision for you. I hope I've helped a bit, rather than confuse.
Peace and blessings to you,
~ Andrea
I do want to answer each of you separately but right now I will just say that all of you are wonderful and thank you for such great support. I have to say that you ALL have given me alot to think about.
I was always told from "day one" of diagnosis of Dry Mouth/Sjorens that if I lost my teeth I couldn't wear dentures due to yeast infections and sores, etc.
What I really need to know from those who wear dentures, do you have a bad case of DRY MOUTH? I know that every person is different.
I have been told that if you don't have enough saliva, the dentures will not fit and stay in. I was also told that good fitting dentures shouldn't have to be used with "glue" products like Polident.
What is a person supposed to believe?
I am scared to death now about the implants as I had no idea that bacteria could get into my jawbone. They had trouble with my bottom right jaw as all the molars had root canals and crowns. Apparently the root canals bond to the bone and are harder to remove.
I know my Mom had dentures all her life and she had dry mouth but I don't know how bad it was as she was never dx'd with anything. She never went to the Dr. for her IBD or any dry issues. She just thought "it was her".
So if those with dentures could tell me how bad their dry mouth is I would greatly appreciate it. I'm going to talk with my husband tomorrow as he is taking me to see the prosthedontist about my dentures.
Oh, and they were put on after my surgery but by 10pm that evening, they were cutting into my gums and the top one seemed to keep filling up with blood and not fitting to my roof of my mouth. I paid alot of money for those dentures also.
I'll let you all know what happens at my appointment.
Thank you again and hugs to you all.
Linda
Quote from: LindaLathrop on December 07, 2011, 10:29:24 PM
I do want to answer each of you separately but right now I will just say that all of you are wonderful and thank you for such great support. I have to say that you ALL have given me alot to think about.
I was always told from "day one" of diagnosis of Dry Mouth/Sjorens that if I lost my teeth I couldn't wear dentures due to yeast infections and sores, etc.
Unfortunately/fortunately nobody told me that. They also did not start me on Salagen/Pilocarpine when it came out in 1998. I have had mouth sores, and I have had yeast infections (1), and kept on trucking.
I did complete a first round of mouth reconstruction with my upper teeth removed and a denture fitted in 2000. Then I came back in 2003-5 for extensive work on the lower teeth, first to remove most of the teeth, then to do extensive and complicated root canal on the remaining five, then to shape these remaining teeth to be supports for a lower denture -- so the denture does not slide around in the mouth.
Quote
What I really need to know from those who wear dentures, do you have a bad case of DRY MOUTH? I know that every person is different.]/quote]
I do now seven years later.
Quote
I have been told that if you don't have enough saliva, the dentures will not fit and stay in.
By whom? A dentist (unbelievable!). By an old wife? possible but not factual.
I haven't had much saliva, and the dentures fit okay. What's more true is that the underlying bone (under all teeth *and* dentures) shrinks somewhat as we age, which affects the fit of dentures.
QuoteI was also told that good fitting dentures shouldn't have to be used with "glue" products like Polident.
That's true for the first couple of years, except when you are first getting used to them, when Poligrip (not Polident, which is denture cleaning product) can be used to cushion the denture between touch ups from the dentist.
Quote
What is a person supposed to believe?
This is why Amazon posts reviews of products. It might also help to get a second (or third or fourth) dentist's opinion. I had that problem with teaching dentists at a school of dental medicine, who couldn't agree on the treatment, and who, when they tried themselves, said (dentist a) my mouth bled too much, and (dentist b) my mouth bled too much. Translation: They didn't want to work on my mouth because the problems of reconstruction (by then) were too complex.
QuoteI am scared to death now about the implants as I had no idea that bacteria could get into my jawbone. They had trouble with my bottom right jaw as all the molars had root canals and crowns. Apparently the root canals bond to the bone and are harder to remove.
Something else: one of my root canals has now been resorbed -- the bone underneath it all has "melted" or been re-absorbed by my body. It just isn't there.
QuoteI know my Mom had dentures all her life and she had dry mouth but I don't know how bad it was as she was never dx'd with anything. She never went to the Dr. for her IBD or any dry issues. She just thought "it was her".
So if those with dentures could tell me how bad their dry mouth is I would greatly appreciate it. I'm going to talk with my husband tomorrow as he is taking me to see the prosthedontist about my dentures.
My dry mouth is less than the minimum definition of dry mouth, of 1.5 mm of saliva generated in 15 minutes. This was done after a long afternoon of talking or sitting and reading without sipping or drinking water. Actually, it varies.
Quote
Oh, and they were put on after my surgery but by 10pm that evening, they were cutting into my gums and the top one seemed to keep filling up with blood and not fitting to my roof of my mouth. I paid alot of money for those dentures also.
I'll let you all know what happens at my appointment.
Thank you again and hugs to you all.
Linda
I hope by now the dentures are less painful. I remember a fairly extended period of getting adjusted to the dentures I wear.
It's routine, now, for me. Whatever your final decision about the best way to go, it does get better, as far as pain. My dentures are very comfortable; not in the "corn on the cob" class, but then I don't much like corn-on-the-cob, anyway.
HUGS
Let us know how it goes,
Soycoffee
Hi Linda,
Welcome to the forum! ;)
I had all my top teeth and most of the bottom removed in April. They had decayed to the point there was no other option. I have dentures for the top now, that I love and plan to have the 4 remaining bottom teeth out early next year and a bottom plate.
In answer to dryness and my denture; it doesn't really seem to be an issue. I just wet the denture down after cleaning, pop it in and I'm good. They are getting loose because I haven't had them relined (sounds like a tire) :) since I got them, but I will do that soon and I expect them to fit well.
I haven't had any infections since I got my dentures. It's been wonderful.
I also would be hesitant of implants, and that's only my personal opinion. I had so many absesses, infections, and thrush before my teeth being extracted that I was at the point of being glad to get rid of them. I wouldn't have been able to afford implants, but even if I could have, I felt that the possibility of any future infections would not be worth it to my health.
No one intends to scare you about implants, but if if were me, I personally would want to research a bit more and talk with my dentist and maybe get a 2nd opinion from another dentist before going forward. You will ultimately make the right choice for you! We're just here giving our personal opinions from our experiences.
I hope our experiences help just a bit. ;)
Take care,
Melinda
I am going to add some more infor. First of all, I corrected a mistake I made in my earlier post. I brush my teeth without regular or any toothpaste. Just to get them clean and usually rinse my mouth with mouthwash.
Anyway, When you have your teeth pulled and place the dentures in your mouth you are going to have blood that pools on the dentures. Some blood anyway. Actually the dentures act like a pressure bandage and help reduce the bleeding.
THe gums are very sensitive are we all know, and they also take quite a while to heal. The idea is to have the gums heal from the inside out to avoid any pockets that can get infected. This is why we have to keep rinsing out mouth out a lot. We have to keep the food particles and debris removed to avoid the increase of infection.
It takes a 2-3 weeks or so for healing. After the teeth are healed good we are more able to tell where the spots are that are too tight or are rubbing on the gums. I had to go back to my dentist many, many, many times to get some areas sanded down. He took it very slow so that he would not take off to much.
Yes, I had to have my dentures relined. This is pretty much normal as the gums shrink up as we heal and the dentures are then too big and need to be relined for a tighter fit. My dentures ended up being pretty comfortable and from early on I used a little Polident or adhesive on the bottom denture. The bottom dentures are notorious for slipping and slidding as there isn't much bony ridge to adhere to.
I eventually had to start putting adhesive on the top denture also but I used the Walmart brand as it doesn't adhere as tight. If I put the Polident on the top denture I could not get it out cause it adhered too good. I wore my temporary dentures for about 5 years and when they got worn off and hard to chew with my dentist made another pair for me.
It does take time and work to get things situated after having your teeth pulled and getting dentures, but once you are settled in with your dentures you adjust to them. I always carry denture adhesive in my purse in case I need more when I am out and about.
There are times that I have to take the dentures out and start over. I used to put too much adhesive on my dentures and the adhesive swells up when it is moistened under the faucet. When this happens the dentures can get too tight and that hurts. Little tricks to learn. Also, if you have a sore starting up you apply denture adhesive in that area and it is a little protection to help enable less friction in that area.
The longer we have our dentures the more our jaws shrink and this can cause the dentures to get more loose. Mine are very loose on the top and the bottom and I put about a 1 inch strip of adhesive on each side of the denture top and bottom, hold the denture under the faucet to wet it down good and place it in the mouth. When you place it in your mouth sort of push it against the gums to help aid in the adhering process.
I wear my dentures to bed at night. At first I didn't but now I just can't take not having the support they give to my bottom jaw. I really think that it is a lot of mind over matter. My dentist told me that I did extremely well in adjusting to my dentures. How did I manage that??? I have no clue. The deal is. My teeth were gone, thank goodness, and I had dentures and that was the way it was. You either sink or swim and adjust. Good luck in your decision. Irish ;D
Irish,
You explain things so well. ;)
Yes, when I had my immediate denture put in at the same appt. when I had my teeth extracted, at first I thought it sounded "barbaric." My very sore mouth with 14 teeth pulled at the same time, and they stick this device in my gums.
As I found out, that was a good way to do. As you say, the denture acts as a pressure bandage. I had some pain for a few days, and some bleeding, but the bleeding was normal. Over time, the sockets where teeth were pulled formed clots or a scab of sorts. (which is what we want to happen.)
I knew that it would take months to have my mouth heal completely, and adjust to the denture. I will have it relined as soon as I have some insurance issues sorted out. It's a little loose now, but some adhesive does the trick. For now, it works great. I know many of you encouraged me so much, and gave so much great info. when I went through this. Thank you!
Linda,
Sort of makes me wonder if you may want to give your denture you have a second chance with some "tweaking" and adjustment. But that's just me and my radical thinking, I guess. :)
Quote from: irish on December 08, 2011, 08:40:23 PMI put about a 1 inch strip of adhesive on each side of the denture top and bottom, hold the denture under the faucet to wet it down good and place it in the mouth.
Irish - interesting. On my Fixodent tube of gel it says to
dry off your dentures before squeezing on a layer of gel. I then get my mouth wet with water and put my dentures in.
When using the Fixodent powder - I get my dentures wet first, then put the powder on and put them in my mouth.
It's been three years, I need to get my dentures relined too . . . I keep putting it off ($$$). The gel helps keep them secure - so for now, I'll just keep using that. ;)
Bucky
Quote from: Meld256 on December 08, 2011, 11:14:33 AM
Welcome to the forum! ;)
I had all my top teeth and most of the bottom removed in April. They had decayed to the point there was no other option. I have dentures for the top now, that I love and plan to have the 4 remaining bottom teeth out early next year and a bottom plate.
. . .
Melinda
Melinda,
My dentist worked very hard to salvage stubs of teeth in the bottom front, to provide something for the bottom denture to adhere to, so it would not slip around in my mouth. The bottom plate fits over the remaining teeth. Worth asking about?
Best,
Soycoffee
Welcome Linda. I will keep you in my thoughts and meditations. Stay strong. (ha! I almost wrote "live long and prosper"!! Well, that too! :) )