Author Topic: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....  (Read 9587 times)

Waldop

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2014, 05:37:00 AM »

Along with what Irish posted  have you been Rx'd Salagen, pilocarpine or such.

 

I have been on Pilocarpine for the past "10" years.  I just now started my diet and have been drinking much more water. Unfortunately, I've had this problem for quite some time. It's not so much that my stools are hard. In fact, it's much looser than necessary. It's just that it seems to get stuck in the middle.... YUCK.... ::)

cccourt1942

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2014, 08:53:48 AM »
Hi all,
    In the spirit of this thread, Happy Pooping to all today!!  I am new and adjusting to all this information  I have recently realized the absence (or decrease) in saliva was likely the culprit in swallowing and hoarseness.  Then I started thinking about my stomach acids.  I have taken Prilosec or Nexium for about 20 years for GERD.  I thought, I probably don't have enough normal mucous in my stomach to produce the normal amount of acid.  Now...after reading this thread, I am finally down to the colon. 

    The one difference between all of you is ...I believe that is accurate...all of your posts voice constipation issues.. .I drink Citrucel every morning.  I know we aren't supposed to promote stuff...but I think of this as telling you my experience...and can't do that without naming the product.  About 20 years ago I saw my first gastroenterologist.  He told me I had reflux.  So he scopes me...and we saw it simultaneously on the screen:  an ulcer.  It was a NSAID ulcer. (yes..the perimeter can help differentiate ulcers.)  He (we) sealed it with medication.  A year later he rescoped...all sealed..a mild blemish...and he says he STILL believes I have reflux.  I will say this, the Prilosec made me feel like a Medrol pack makes me feel today!!  When I had initially seen him I referred to my irregularity and a couple of severe gastric episodes resulting in bloody diarrhea.  He dx me with IBS.  I hadn't had a colonoscopy at that point.  So he adds Citrucel to my daily regime.  At that time other than an antihistamine, the Prilosec was my  one daily med.  (oh..remember all...20 years ago I was in menopause...everything goes haywire during menopause!)

The Citrucel constipated me.  I was leaving on a trip with three friends.  The gastro told me to drink a citrate drink which I cannot recall the name.  I found it at the  drugstore.  They were about 6 oz bottles.  This helped after about three days.  Problem solved.

I have the colonoscopy...NOTHING...nothing noted at all.  So..all better???  NO.  About 6 months later I return to the dr with the ongoing constipation issues.  He begs me to try Citrucel again.  He said, "take it for a month...regularly...and then call me.  He said he bet I would be the Citrucel queen after one month."  He was right.   

In all those years I have missed no more than 10 days with this miracle FOR ME.  He stated (I am repeating..so do not know if this is true...but he is the doctor) the Citrucel worked with the colon.  He compared it to popular "laxative" drinks which had psyllium seeds in them which "did the work" for your colon.  In other words, your colon retained its muscle usage with the Citrucel.  That sounds strange...hope you get the gist.  This was a doctor who was having digestion problems in high school...and when finishing medical school he said it was a no brainer for him in choosing a specialization.  He said in the 10 years since his first problems, he had acquired many more.  I always thought he should have been in research! 

Take this info as something to discuss with your physicians.  I do not advise taking anything I am recommending outside lip balm.  It's just my story and my success with a product. 

btw: I do NOT have IBS or IBD.  I have had three "Crohn's like" attacks (no diagnosis for any of them..."colitis" [which of course all of you know doesn't stand alone:  ULCERATIVE colitis is the real name.] )  I was 35, 44, and 65 when I had these three attacks.  Colonoscopy after only one of the attacks.  NOTHING showed up. Nothing. 

Have a great, "relieved" day.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2014, 08:59:27 AM by cccourt1942 »
Sjogren's, Psoriasis, Hashimoto's, Osteoporosis, Osteoarthritis, Cold hands/feet,  fatigue,  pilocarpine-25 mg , Restasis, Plaquenil, Low dose Prednisone (2-3 mg daily) Xylimelt, Citrucel, Alcon-Naturale, Tears,Omega 3, Vit.D, Caltrate+D3, Fosamax, CoQ10, Zinc, Oxtellar. Levothyroxene

daisymae

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2014, 11:03:38 AM »
I'm glad this topic was brought up too.

I have the exact same issues as susanap. I have to pee frequently and then all of a sudden I'm going number 2 with no warning. And almost always incomplete emptying.

I had been constipated badly for about 1 1/2 years (starting about 8 mos before my sjogrens diagnosis) which I attributed to going on cymbalta.

Then I went to Mexico in December and got a touch of travellers diarrhea, which at first I actually welcomed as I wasn't constipated. But I still have loose stools and incomplete emptying almost 3 mos later, despite taking probiotics.

It's getting intolerable with bloating, gas, and unpredictable urgency and the runs.

I'm going to my pcp to see if it's still the travellers diarrhea or getting into IBS. I read that travellers diarrhea can trigger IBS. Or maybe I already had it before.

I hope you find some answers, Barrie.

Waldop

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #18 on: February 23, 2014, 01:57:46 PM »
I'm glad this topic was brought up too.

I have the exact same issues as susanap. I have to pee frequently and then all of a sudden I'm going number 2 with no warning. And almost always incomplete emptying.

I had been constipated badly for about 1 1/2 years (starting about 8 mos before my sjogrens diagnosis) which I attributed to going on cymbalta.

Then I went to Mexico in December and got a touch of travellers diarrhea, which at first I actually welcomed as I wasn't constipated. But I still have loose stools and incomplete emptying almost 3 mos later, despite taking probiotics.

It's getting intolerable with bloating, gas, and unpredictable urgency and the runs.

I'm going to my pcp to see if it's still the travellers diarrhea or getting into IBS. I read that travellers diarrhea can trigger IBS. Or maybe I already had it before.

I hope you find some answers, Barrie.

Thanks, daisymae.....  If it weren't for forums such as this, I would NEVER have the answers that I'm looking for. Unfortunately, my rheumatologist never really examines me like he probably should. The fact of the matter being, he rarely changes his treatment and that's not good.  When I complain of painful glands he just takes it for granted and says and DOES nothing!!  It really rubs me the wrong way!!

Carolina

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #19 on: February 23, 2014, 03:34:49 PM »
Oh Barrie,

Another Rheumatologist who is resigning......

The thing is that they ignore things because they do not KNOW.  So much more mature to say,

"well I understand that your glands are sore, and that could be from Sjogren's (if that's your diagnosis).  Let's write it down now, keep track of it, and if it doesn't resolve in X amount of time, we can consider some tests.

We don't know everything with autoimmune conditions, Barrie, and there is some discomfort that is part of the condition, and doesn't respond particularly to additional treatment, if there are additional treatments.
I know it is hard to be uncomfortable, have you tried a pain reliever?  Track your symptoms, and if they continue we can discuss this at our next visit."

This would 1) validate you  2) establish a method of tracking symptoms  3) establish a time-line for further action.

Now you just feel dismissed as a whiner, without even a consideration of what you've expressed and are experiencing.  Honestly, these doctors just need some good manners!

Oh well.  That's how I feel about it.  I really do think lots of doctors don't like to deal with women who are sick in a chronic way......I think it is 'mother issues' myself.

Hugs,  Elaine



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mambo

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #20 on: February 23, 2014, 08:27:45 PM »
That issue of constipation is not specific to Sjogren's nor with connective tissue autoimmune disease.  Yes, there is some overlap with possible slow transit and lack of moisture. 

But I've found that the biggest cause of constipation in those with autoimmunity is gut dysbiosis.  It is basically an imbalance of gut flora resulting from antibiotics, anti-inflammatories, and other medications you've been on for years.  It might show up the same time you're diagnosed with Sjogren's.  Or it might predate your Sjogren's.  Or it might show up much later after the onset.  But gut dysbiosis is as common to autoimmunity as leaky gut is.

The reason why gut dysbiosis is common is that if it wasn't involved in kickstarting autoimmunity to begin with, by contributing to intestinal permeability, you might have developed it much later with the medications frequently prescribed to treat it.  If you have Bristol Chart 1-3 and various other symptoms of constipation, then you probably have gut dysbiosis.  Those other symptoms are:  slow transit, lack of peristalsis, lack of moisture, stool density, etc.  But you need certain gut bacteria species (Bacteroides) to give moisture to your stool and hold your stool together, not separate it like rabbit droppings. 

The cure is to restore balance to your gut flora by taking probiotics and prebiotics.  The most effective therapy, especially if you've had constipation characterized by pellet stool (Bristol Chart 1), is to take prebiotics to prime your gut flora and then probiotics.  The easiest option is to take the cheapest and most available commercially available prebiotic in the form of resistant starch (RS); you may not even need probiotics since it feeds the gut bacteria that may have been under pressure from pathogenic bacteria.

You can read about gut dysbiosis and the RS therapy to restore normal BM right here:

http://freetheanimal.com/2013/12/resistant-primer-newbies.html

gphx

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #21 on: February 23, 2014, 09:45:56 PM »
I like simple answers.

I've noticed taking vitamin C to extremes can cause diarrhea. Eating a lot of fat can cause food to pass through the system quite quickly.

When experiencing the opposite problem of slow transit a bit of vitamin C and dietary or supplemental oils such as fish oil, evening primrose, flaxseed, or coconut oils on a daily basis can compensate for the problem in a natural and unobtrusive way.

Just be careful not to overdo them or you'll end up with the opposite problem. It's fairly easy to adjust your daily dosage until you find just the right balance for you.
Dxed unspecific 'sicca syndrome' eyes and mouth. Neuro issues, muscle weakness. SS Seronegative but high inflammatory markers. Diabetes dx 2010. Glucose control improved neuromuscular issues. Enlarged thyroid under observation 2013. Yippee.

irish

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #22 on: February 23, 2014, 10:39:12 PM »
Another reason that the gut can be influenced by an inappropriate bacterial growth has little to do with the antibiotics and everything to do with the sjogrens. With the sjogrens our saliva is decreased which in turn doesn't dilute the acid in the stomach. With this upset in acid balance the normal flora get all screwed up. We normally have around 700 bacteria in our mouth that is supposed to be there to help start the digestion of food and to keep the cavities away plus more things that I don't know about. Also bacteria are programmed to survive in a certain environment and the GI tract that is too acidy can kill off some of them.

This absence of saliva to dilute the the acid also contributes to the reflux. There are very very sjoggies who get by without getting reflux. Just the reflux and decrease in saliva alone sets our colon up for all kinds of strange events. When we eat fiber or take and laxative product with fiber we have to make sure to take more fluid as our intestinal tract operates differently than normal people and without extra fluid the fiber can make us constipated.

Also, there are many types of colitis and I think that having an autoimmune disease sets us up for colitis that isn't always easily diagnosed. My hubby has Celiac sprue since 1978 and was diagnosed with ulcerative colitis based on colon tissue biopsies only to have the biopsies done 10 years later with a change in diagnosis. He was told he has microscopic colitis ( I think that is correct) and that this is very common in people with celiac disease. It is really miserable and can upset your life plus cause bleeding, but it is not as destructive as the ulcerative colitis. I know that I have attacks of colitis at times and one time it lasted 4 months. Many years later my immunologist asked why they didn't give me any prednisone and I had no answer. The doc back then had no clue what it was and when I think back I can only think "why in the heck, didn't that doctor think autoimmune cause ulcerative colitis and autoimmune diseases have been around for a long time.".

Hope everyone is getting their gut in order!!!

Waldop, Yes, it is me!!!! I have been hanging around here for about 10 years now. I am one of the oldest ones on here and am still able to count to ten most days. Hope that you are doing ok. Just an update, I have been doing IVIG for 7 years for my myasthenia gravis and lt helps my low t-cells. I am also on prednisone, Plaquenil and just started the cellcept 2 months ago cause my myasthenia is getting worse--especially in the summer. Have had to take higher dosage of prednisone and the docs want me to get that dosage lower thus the cellcept.  Take care all. Irish

Waldop

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #23 on: February 24, 2014, 07:13:26 AM »
I have this issue..stomach just paralyzed..i have gastroparesis.

I think the neuro issues, muscle issues with sjogrens play a huge part.

I also learned that less fiber works better for me...too much can cause binding.

Ohhhhh, these stomachs. Seems so many of us have problems. Even as a child, I always had trouble.
I never got the "urge" to have a bowel movement...even back then, I had some gastroparesis, which I thought
was just constipation at the time.

Gursie

Thanks for your input, Gursie!! I couldn't agree more!! Truth be told, I've had stomach problems from the time I was born. I once told my gastro doctor, "I was born with a bad stomach and I'll die with one!"  He was a little ticked at me for having such an attitude.  I'm a realist and I know what my body can tolerate and what it has difficult with, pure and simple. 

I'm sorry to hear about the gastroparesis. I hear that can be awful!!   :(  You take care of yourself...

Barrie***

jpd54

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #24 on: February 24, 2014, 08:37:21 AM »
I also have that problem.  I have tried softeners, laxatives, prunes and anything else I can think of.  I would take up to three softeners a night.  Nothing helped. 

My primary care physician has tried different medications.  He just put me on Linzess.  It has been successful.  I even feel better on it.  Not as much backup and bloating.

This condition is not one of the fun parts of Sjogren's.   :(

            Jennifer
SJS, Fibro, Osteoarthritis, Osteoporosis, GERD, Rosacea, TMJ

Celebrex, Gabapentin, Lasix, Potassium,Hydroxychloroquine, Lexapro, Lisinopril / Hydrochlorothiazide, Linzess, Metoclopram, Nexium, Oracea, Savella, Simvastatin, Vitamin D, Voltaren

mambo

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #25 on: March 17, 2014, 06:32:21 PM »
I think you're misunderstanding the concept.  We're not talking about the bacteria in your mouth but the bacteria in your large intestine, which are the largest species of gut microbes found in the human body.  Those bacterial species are unrelated to gut dysbiosis, which specifically refers to the imbalance of gut microbes in your large intestine, not in your mouth or in your small intestine.  These are the bacteria which play a specific role in stool formation and peristalsis by giving volume and moisture to the stool, softening its passage through the lower digestive tract.

And the point regarding stomach acid and the GI tract is wrong.  The pH level in the GI tract is completely different from the urinary pH or serum pH.  Most beneficial bacteria thrive in acidic (i.e., low pH) conditions, not in an alkaline environment; that is exactly what butyrate does, lowers the pH of the large intestine through fermentation so that these beneficial bacteria can thrive.  This has nothing to do with the serum acid-base balance which those in alternative medicine like to squawk about.  And this has nothing to do with metabolic acidosis.

Another reason that the gut can be influenced by an inappropriate bacterial growth has little to do with the antibiotics and everything to do with the sjogrens. With the sjogrens our saliva is decreased which in turn doesn't dilute the acid in the stomach. With this upset in acid balance the normal flora get all screwed up. We normally have around 700 bacteria in our mouth that is supposed to be there to help start the digestion of food and to keep the cavities away plus more things that I don't know about. Also bacteria are programmed to survive in a certain environment and the GI tract that is too acidy can kill off some of them.

This absence of saliva to dilute the the acid also contributes to the reflux. There are very very sjoggies who get by without getting reflux. Just the reflux and decrease in saliva alone sets our colon up for all kinds of strange events. When we eat fiber or take and laxative product with fiber we have to make sure to take more fluid as our intestinal tract operates differently than normal people and without extra fluid the fiber can make us constipated.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2014, 06:34:56 PM by mambo »

gemini052377

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2014, 07:03:02 PM »
Thank you for bringing light to this topic. Sadly it too is one of the many issues I have been battling. It is so frustrating and can make one feel so miserable. To have the urge, then sit for a prolonged amount of time for incomplete or no results. Increase in fluid consumption (I drink mostly water), reduced caffeine, whole grain foods, and all the fruits/veggies in the world have not helped at all!

Now it is even worse since removing all gluten type foods from my diet. High fiber, bulky foods aren't working.

I feel so bad that each of you experience the same, what a blessing it would be for all of us to have relief from this miserable disease and ask it's side effects.

Take care, Mary
Mary-Primary Sjogren' s, Hashimoto' s Auto Immune Thyroid, Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Reynauds, and busy mom of 4 kiddos :)

LucyD

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2014, 07:08:03 PM »
This is all very interesting. And it makes a lot of sense to me from a layman's standpoint that AI and Sjogren's issues (especially as Irish with her medical knowledge posted) can have effects on our ability to move our bowels. I have had a problem since I was a child!
And yes, mine just gets "stuck" sometimes. I am sorry if this is too graphic, but I was at work one day recently and felt backed up but also sort of like I needed to try to go. Worked so hard at it! Was stuck in the bathroom for about 15 minutes, perspiring from all of the work - honestly. It wouldn't come out and it wouldn't go back in and it was hard as a rock. I FINALLY pushed hard enough and got it out. This is probably sounding funny to some and sort of gross to others. I had to laugh. I work at a hospital. I had visions of having to call someone to come help me get it out!!!! I hope this never happens again. But I get very close to it sometimes.

Thanks for all of the good information. I think I will buy some Citrucel. I remember using it years ago and it helped.
Dxs: Sjogren's - seronegative, UCTD, soft tissue joint pain, Hypothyroidism
Medications: Plaquenil 400 mg/day, Restasis, Synthroid, Cytomel, Celexa, Deplin (L-methylfolate) (for MTHFR genetic defect)
Age: 65

gemini052377

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2014, 07:13:54 PM »
Yes LucyD, I have had to assist more than a few pts in my nursing career as well. Let's just say I never want to be on the receiving end of a soap suds enema, disimpacton or milk of mag cocktail we would give.

So frustrating!
Mary-Primary Sjogren' s, Hashimoto' s Auto Immune Thyroid, Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Reynauds, and busy mom of 4 kiddos :)

Velcro

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Re: Pardon my graphic description.... Having problems Defecating....
« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2014, 06:31:23 AM »
Yes, I have had this issue for some time.  I just started taking magnesium (100 mg) and potassium (99 mg) daily, on the advice on a Holistic pharmacist because I was searching for some muscle pain relief.  The side effect I am getting is softer stools and regularity.  It has helped my bloating and my stools now are smaller and softer.  It literally has solved that problem for the time being.